Rosa interviews Lorenzo interviews Rosa

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Rosa interviews Lorenzo

Wat is je voorspelling van een zomerhit van 2024? Cabin crew - the spark

Thema's (don't quote me on this ;) ): Accessibility, 3D/virtual, Walking (from memory) as a method, (Counter) Mapping, Maar ook non-counter-mapping via Obsidian, Glossary's, etc → Creating structure in structurelessness? internet culture, burst writing, community? Klopt dit? Ik ga van 3D world building naar "hoe wil ik omgaan met?" Waar wordt het voor gebruikt? De gemeente zit op een heel ander level dan de bewoners. Cyber punk during the day. Van wie is de stad? De stad wordt gefictionaliseerd. Probeer nu 3D om te draaien, Unity een beetje zat Ander perspectief op 3D/games sinds corodna - Samen met vrienden, ontsnappen in het verhaal. Waar(om) is cyber punk om geschreven? Techno capital, verdienen op de stad. Door relateren naar Rotterdam. Op welke manier is Rotterdam Cyber Punk? Visueel: De sting geeft 's avonds licht. De reclame zuilen in de regen. Conceptueel: Hofplein 2024 video - PolderPunk. Zit de techno capitalischtische laag in. wat is rotterdam 2040? Ik probeer een narratief te schetsen: Wat zit achter het decor van Rotterdam? Wie zijn er uitgenodigd voor Rotterdam 2040? Hoe draag je daar aan bij als innovatielab?

Wat wil je er mee gaan maken? Ik ben met maps bezig, Leaflet, liminal en subliminal spaces. Terugkerend thema: Ik wil het decor optillen. (Team America style). (Un)Affordable spaces, is niet voor jou. De mensen die expat woningen maken (Expat exploitanten), zitten aan de verkeerde kant. Unaffordable space: Nu kan je niet meer door CS lopen zonder in te checken. Voor iemand in een rolstoel kan iets ook een liminal space zijn ."Dit wordt gebouwd maar niet voor jou".

Zou je (meer) willen schrijven? En in welke vorm dan? Ja. Ook burst writing, maar ook geinspireerd door Dune 2 als structuur, waar veel symbolische groepen in zitten, om na te denken over meer lange (non?) ficite.

Counter mapping - wat is dat? Points of in (in)access, maar ook het roepen van namen van mensen die zijn overleden dankzij politiegeweld is ook een vorm van counter mapping. Het is best een open source begrip. Een mindmap kan ook een counter map zijn. Gaat het om de counter map of om de act of counter mapping Gaat er om "To aankaart", Filmen van KBK om de rolstoel-toegankelijkheid voor een student te testen→ Dachten dat het vanuit een instantie was. Er zijn verschillende manier om dat te doen, maar het moet wel "productief" blijven - dus niet een soort DDOS attack op de gemeente, of alleen maar uitwijzen wat er kut is. Maar ook: in hoeverre is het OV openbaar? Counter mapping is voor mij een manier om dat inzichtelijk te maken.

En counter mapping in workshop format? Ik zou het wel interessant vinden om bijv. bij een gemeente te gaan werken, en samen naar oplossingen te gaan kijken.

Toen hadden we het over references hier nog een extra: 

(Digital) Dérive
Applied with the attitude/awareness of contamination. To walk (work) together. How can we go on a walk together, even when this is not possible? When we walk together naturally, we don’t all move in exactly the same way, but we are sharing an experience in common. To work together doesn’t have to mean losing the agency—ability to choose, to act, and to feel empowered—that comes from being individuals. Walking together is finding a way to share something while still holding space for difference. The act of controlled falling can mean many things, but we will focus on the idea of walking as a form of paying attention, which is to say a form of listening in to our environment (and to each other).

To dérive. To drift. Here we arrive at a very specific type of walking developed by the Situationist International, a group of artists and political theorists whose collective practice conceptualized different forms of critique on capitalism. In a nutshell, to dérive is to set aside a concrete time of the day to drop all other activities to go and explore a place with deep attention and openness to the unexpected. To digress. To suddenly go off the main road of thought. (Digital) Spaces have a geography, a spatial design, that affects us on a psychological level. Digital bodies are not entirely disconnected projections of our actual bodies.

To contaminate. She said, “If you already know what you’re researching, then you’re not doing research. You deepen knowledge through questioning your original frames, how you began, and what the destination is. What are the I’s and what are the we’s in a group dynamic, and how can these contaminate each other generously to arrive at a place of common ground?” I wrote, “Contamination can also be read as being aware of the red flags in contaminatory situations—being radicalized into an extreme position, for example. Especially in a physical sense, given we are in a pandemic.” They replied,” And ha, since you opened it up and i started thinking… and i like just thinking and sharing… what if maybe there can be an undercurrent to contamination which is something like curiosity or stretching-out or extending lines/making meshworks? we are not a stable entity. we should instead resist purity and open ourselves up to the wider things that we are already a part of.”

Overige vragen:

  • Wat is structurelessness?
  • Wat is een non-hierarchical community? Is XPUB een non-hierarchical community?
  • Is lopen de "beste" method of transportation in Rotterdam? Of juist niet?
  • Is het vooral "fysieke" of ook digitale toegankelijkheid?
  • Wat is counter mapping eigenlijk?
  • Heb je al een idee/richting voor je graduation project?
  • Hoe zou een bug report er uit zien? Kan dat "al" via de bestaande kanalen van de gemeente?
  • Inaccessible Geocaching
  • Why do people like Susan Bijl bags?


Reference https://socialpractices20-21.hotglue.me/ https://beggingandgiving.se/en/index/ the century of the self V2 3d scanner` speculative design boek Galaxy writing workshop https://robinrutenberg.com/projects https://www.thewritersguide.nl/


Lorenzo's questions for Rosa

intro vinyl scratches and sepia imagery(and sounds haha): welcome to the Rosa tapes ~!Attention: these questions are based on random assumptions in a very vague lazy state of mind. I tried to absorb as much as possible!

°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°overly detailed summary:°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°

is the idea of performance through machine / human something that could be considered a red thread?

Machines yes, Performance asin Performance art, no- I do a lot with sounds, on that matter performance is inevitable but I find performance to be really horrible

Performances asin hardware / software performances, how you function as human-to-machine and vice versa, but also the audio-hard&software related performances. Asin Look Mum No Computer and live ableton; human interaction

no, I studied Communication and Multimedia Design (cmd) / Human Computer Design, that was about the interaction with computational devices. But not perse in aspect. At least, never thought about it in that way

Yeah, I meant it like the actions, verbs, 'ings', machine like things. More like the process? Yes, more like that / I'm a nerd when it comes to processes

Nerd as an artistic practice? Exactly, Everything comes down to processes in my practice

Amazing because that is my next question; On the idea of Experimentation through programming / finding connections -> is your artistic practice based on the idea of following a process or protocol? Or execution of a process / protocol. ehmm, I think I'm quite the process-orientated person and I also try to document in a process-like method. Recently I was installing a Server on laptop and in the meanwhile I was documenting everything while I was waiting.

Step-by-step? Yeah because it's good also to fall back on when I'm using the same thing to see "How did I manage to do that then" It's more a personal way as a documentation tool. Because I tend be chaotic sometimes and in that mode I sometimes lose track off what I am doing. So the systematic way is the only way to function.

Okay, yeah, clear. hahaha and continuing on that, just a general remark, your wiki page is a nice projection of how you think (at least that's what I make of it). You print this quite well on your wiki pages. I enjoy the things that you do because you put these nice comments behind them as well. As in the correlation between the comment and the documentation? It's all Obsidian in the end, I'm using pan doc to convert to mediawiki- Yeah it's in there and it looked like the thing Manetta showed before in PDF modus. I recognized the style. There's a plugin to export to shell towards the desktop and then I can copypaste it in Mediawiki

I'll contact you about this later haha,ehmm.. the next question is "What are your current projects, I see you attend and maybe perform a lot, experimenting with machines performance / performing with experimental machines

Yeah, in three weeks I'm gonna give a workshop in circuit bending, that's something I really like to do, some sort of performance. Other than that I'm making synthesizers and such and that's an ongoing practice. I'm still searching for what I'm doing.

Yeah, I was referring to more like in relation to XPUB and SI24. But your focus at the moment is more towards a performance then? Yeah, well tbh I'm not doing anything related to XPUB and that is kind of an experiment to see how long it will take before they find out I think it's lame to do stuff that I don't feel like doing and not making something for the sake of making. With the current special issue about loitering. It's not really my cup of tea. I mean I can force myself into doing my best to make something but I can also just not do it. I'm reading a lot and I'm enjoying that actually

So you're focusing more on the methods? Exactly! So that's why my reader is getting more attention and extensiv. Yes, so the PMOMM Yeah I can't concentrate in these collective reading sessions

°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°summary from certain moment and just the gist of things:°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°

reading reading reading searching searching searching making with purpose rather than making for the sake of making methods / readers / research >>>

Fundament of projects through research machine practice

unionizing factory workers as first industrial anarchists

disconnected from the trimester / visiting VONK - walks; difference municipality -> stickers local governments == innovation labs? quite some obvious things -- bullshit bingo, agency in scrum------ nudging looks like software methods to make you use more fb (poke?)

glitching municipality 3D heads -- ambtenarij / expected cmd instead of xpub

memes / cultural references as enlightening difficult subjects? thesis without memes is out of the question no structure but fun while writing

from a commercial pov, anarchist viewpoint; ableton/touchdesigner -> critical or entertainment "stealing ideas" pirating wisdom. How would I do this; humanifying perfomances.

Lovely software but expensive af, ableton is akschually giving back yet commercial, less than adobe (strawman argument hahaha), freesoftware = never free; people making softwares, TD = free til 720px exporting. Pretty things for the sake pretty things. Robert Henkie breaks down technical aspects; founder of Ableton.

TD hyped up; 3D unreal/unity/c4d; WHY USE IT FOR NFT. subscription based fancy aesthetics -> creative coding dribbl / insta. Softwares to be entertained with.


Educational aspirations? Workshops on the side, didactic passionate patience. Documentation for myself (comments) markdown for dayzzz.

Gemeentewebsite -> leaflet.js meldR

previous questions? what do you do with it recurring themes fundamentals -> thesis reverse engineering printing; building, infinite loop repaircafe / webstack; github alternatives; gitty; github hosts?

lowcode-nocode ; AI -> how to form opinions on that

AI dunno what to work with it;

AI; ChatGPT I use it. / too much words. / AI costs alot -> laziness; program help -> smart autocomplete.


creativity killed by laziness // you ask a machine how to machine talk outsourcing intelligence -> dumber your brain controlling / tool ChatGPT but with a lot of computer

Don't translate because no idea

thrown around; AI Wireframe -> AI won't fix the worth and content

CHATGPT -> interpretation is very well done; interesting responses

human control; outsourcing to closed sources;


what is your connection to this trimester? do you feel that you have a connection? not quite / verschil met een innovatielab en een sticker? Nudges relation to municipality.

Are cultural references important in your work? do they enlighten the subjects? enlightening is better

How do you look at the commercial appeal of software like ableton / touchdesigner / other things that are used in coding events? Do you go to these events to be entertained, is there a critical lense?

pirating ideas -> how would I do it? / human-relation in nerves / ableton expensive but it gives back -> free software is not free but they're not forcing / content must be insightful -> technical makers meet up



Workshop / circuit bending - synthesizers making development - XPUB-related? not really feel related. Reading / methods <3 - attention span relatable - self-practice. Supporting arguments by reading -> anticonsumerism anarchist methods.



references will come with conversation

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